What do you guys do to motivate yourself to do programming?
I used to program for hours every day but for almost a year now I have a very hard time igniting that passion that drove me create so many applications that you guys have seen and other ones that I used at my job. With Bob passing and PB in a state of limbo, I think that has just compounded my lack of interest (not sure if "lack of interest" are the right words).
I know that Jose feels the same way and Dominique has for a long time seems to have chosen cycling and outdoor activities over PB coding.
Maybe it will hit me like a flash some day and everything will return to normal. Maybe I burned myself out and the thrill of discovery is not as great as it used to be. Maybe a break is what I needed after 20 years of churning out code.
How about you guys? How do you do it? Mountain Dew and Caffeine? :)
I think it is this feeling of insecurity, not knowing if your work might be in vain because all over sudden PB might disappear. I remember I felt the same when VB6 was replaced by Net. I never liked Net, the last Visual Studio I bought was VB2005 Pro, and I did not make much use of it, just toying around, but never wrote a commercial program on it.
But think how many folks are still using VB6 though there is no support by MS anymore. I myself keep up a couple of VB6 programs down until today. I think it would be the same with PB. On a smaller scale of course, but it will we a great tool still for many years - especially with a great RAD tool like FireFly wrapped around it. I think there are many programmers that do not want to go mainstream with those Giganto Suites, that love a clean, straightforward environment. The combination of PB with FireFly and with Josè's great wrappers is a real fantastic instrument.
It might be a good idea though to save those great resources of the PB forum somehow. I remember Borje's Poffs program to read the forum offline - something of that sort, or even use Poffs itself.
So cheer up, Paul, the future is not that grim as it might look now. There are many developers depending on your work. Get that dot syntax implementet, whip out FireFly4 and collect some money from it. Then the future will look brighter again.
There many folks that love you, your work, and this forum.
Rolf
My motivation was to explore new techniques, but with the failure of Windows 8 and the current situation of PB...
Quote from: Rolf Brandt on September 11, 2013, 02:41:40 AM
I think it is this feeling of insecurity, not knowing if your work might be in vain because all over sudden PB might disappear.
I think you may have the answer there. Years and years of work that might be irrelevant kind of hits you hard especially with every day that goes by with nothing from PB.
I've always been an "As needed" type of programmer, so I'll normally go a long time between projects (so long that I regularly find myself having to relearn FireFly & PB).
I've got other interests, my main one being electronics, where I find that programming is just a way of getting the hardware to work. :)
Take a break and enjoy yourself, there are other things to do beside slinging code all day.
Perhaps a simple hit list of what you want to do .. work a topic , take a break..
I code in spurts as well ... sometimes I really want to make it happen, and other times I just don't care...
You have to have a real sense of purpose in order to code anyway.....
Long ago I got my first computer and was interested in the fact that after all that $$$$ about all I had was a blinking cursor ...
I studied discrete logic in Electronics School, but had never really worked with computers.. so I bought magazines with pages of DATA statements and started programming that way .. then on to the languages of the day....
I found it much like learning to play a musical instrument .. a lot of time to get minimal results .... but since there were few programs out in the wild... I was forced to do it myself..
I liked BASIC syntax and eventually stuck with it.. but over the years since I only programmed for small work projects and myself I found that someone else had probably done a program that works for me and since I am so slow at coding found that I was writing code less and less..
But there are still times when I feel the need to write some code... but as time grows shorter I do tend to code less..
"Paul Squires @PlanetSquires 25 Aug
I have the #PS4 pre-ordered! Can't wait to get the new #Battlefield4 for it. #rockthebattlefield"
Oh, *NOW* I see where all your motivation went... LOL!
Hi Paul,
First of all, your work can never be in irrelevant. That is just fact! I made a program that helped reduce infections in a hospital. I did not get any money for it. But knowing it helped, it really is making a difference for patients is very motivating. And guess what Paul, without you this would never have happened. That is just a fact! I would never have made it with just PB alone, it couldn't. So in a real sense your product helped made that difference. That is just fact! PB going down cannot change that. The program is still running. It's still doing it's job.
Another motivation is money. I am not afraid to tell this. The programming I do aside from my main job can be rewarding for the above reasons but I do get some money also. It is not much, I probably could not live from it but I can reward myself with a new iPhone every year, a new computer, a Sonos playbar... I have probably said this before to you but you should really charge for FF upgrades. If at the end of an upgrade cycle you end up with just a couple of hundred dollars that you can spend the way you want! Newest games for one ;)
The above is off course in the case you are talking about programming as a side job. I mean FF. If it is programming during your main job you need another kind of speech.
Very best regards,
Marc
Hi Marc - thanks for letting me know about your hospital app. Pretty cool that our tools are being used in such a worthwhile place. Programming is not my main job. Maybe it is because my main job has gotten so busy that it cuts into my free time. Maybe I'm too tired by the time I get a chance to start programming. :) I have never been motivated by money when it comes to programming although the money has helped me buy the right tools to make programming easier. I love the thrill of building things and expanding my knowledge and programming always gave me a sense of discovery and learning.
Quote from: John Waalkes on September 14, 2013, 01:06:47 AM
"Paul Squires @PlanetSquires 25 Aug
I have the #PS4 pre-ordered! Can't wait to get the new #Battlefield4 for it. #rockthebattlefield"
Oh, *NOW* I see where all your motivation went... LOL!
hahahahaha! Looks like I'm busted! :)
I do play video games even though I am in my 40's. I wouldn't classify myself as a diehard gamer but I do love paying the Battlefield series. That is the one game that I regularly play. I am at the highest levels possible in both Bad Company 2 and Battlefield 3:
http://bf3stats.com/stats_ps3/rambotheman
http://bfbcs.com/stats_ps3/rambotheman
I never got into those types of games but I was an avid EverQuest player up until recently.
Still love the game but so little time to play.
Motivation to program? I thought programation was the motivation itself! I Enjoy programming. :)
FWIW Paul, I spend about 50% of my time at work programming. I have an "apprentice" working for me that probably spends 40% of her time coding. All in FireFly/PowerBASIC. I didn't panic with recent events at PB, once I realized that the compiler will continue to work even if the product is (heaven forbid) discontinued. In the past 5 years, we have used FF to create award-winning (literally) add-ons to our ERP system, saving nearly $1 million in the process. Complex reports are a snap. Customers applaud our quality inspection tracking. So if anything, take encouragement knowing that the tools you make are important to us. Did I mention that I would gladly pay real money for an expanded version of the Excel/XML tool you recently released? We use it literally every day.
That said, I'm a very, very satisfied FireFly customer. I have a wish list, of course, but none of them are show stoppers. I've tinkered with C# and the latest VB, but can't say I'm ready to start coding there very much; FF/PB does it better for me. Windows 8 Modern (or "Metro", whatever) apps are of no interest to me right now.
Keep doing what you do -- gradual, useful enhancements that are evolutionary -- as the muse strikes. I promise I'll keep buying the upgrades. To answer your original question, I sometimes just walk away from programming for a while. I find that a few days of something else helps me get back in the programming groove.
Paul,
I understand about work cutting into programming time but not in the way most do.
I do my best programming when I first get up.
I worked for GE for 37 years in a blue collar manufacturing environment. During that time I only spent 4 years on days. I always worked second or third shift.
I would get up and code until it was time to go to work. At one point,as the result of a layoff, I found myself on days with the inability to code when I got home. It was then I decided to go to bed at 4PM and get up at 10PM. I then coded until it was time for work at 7AM. Worked for me until a second shift job opened up.
James
Same thing happens to me, but I feel most productive after about 10pm until about 3-4am.
I recognise myself in many of the posts in this thread.
Programming is not my day job, although I write software tools to support me in my day job.
Programming has been my hobby-that-got-out-of-hand for years :)
I wrote an encryption library (HIME) that I sell commercially. When that was 'finished', I started programming an arbitrary precision floating point math library. That went fine until I started struggling with some programming problem. I kept dwelling on it for so long until suddenly I found myself tired of programming ...
I started doing something else in my spare time. My interest went to ... the stock market .. :)
I started programming a tool in FF related to stock trading. Still in my spare time so progress is very slow (to put it mildly).
But I am in no hurry and programming is fun again. My floating point math lib remains 80% finished though :)
So my advice in two words: If you are tired of programming, try something else for a while and after a while you will become attracted to programming again. If you are a professional programmer it is not so easy, but maybe you can try to start another project. That is often refreshing (in whatever profession).
Specific to your concerns, Paul. If ever something would happen to PowerBASIC, would it be thinkable to convert FireFly so it can use another compiler, such as PureBasic? Or would that be a gigantic undertaking?
Anyway, PowerBASIC will remain useable for many years, I'm sure. Look at how many people are still using VB6.
PS. Maybe Paul has already found himself an additional hobby ... :D http://www.paulsquires.com/
Kind regards
:) I've been trying to get that PaulSquires.com domain name for years. There was one time when he was close to having the domain expire but he renewed it at the last possible moment.
FireFly can use other compilers - it would just be a matter of creating a generic backend. Maybe generate xml code that represents the various important pieces of infomation needed during the compile process. Anyone would then be able to write a program in the language of their choice that would read the XML and then generate the final code to be compiled. That's the easy part. The problem part is that the code editor built into FireFly is very PB specific. It would be probably require that FireFly read some type of ini files that define the various procedure handlers (WM_COMMAND, CUSTOM, etc) and also how FireFly would parse to determine the Subs/Functions, Type structures, variables, etc. I have created a FreeBasic version of FireFly but FreeBasic somewhat closely resembles PowerBasic so the conversion is a little easier. If it were C/C++ or similar then it would be harder.
I am getting more and more motivated by coding the new FireFly dot syntax: http://www.planetsquires.com/protect/forum/index.php?topic=3354.0
The general framework is in place and is operating very well. Just need to continue working on adding all of the properties and methods for all of the different forms, controls, menus, statusbars, etc...
Yes, Yes, Yes!!! :D :D :D :D
Paul is back.
Quote from: TechSupport on September 18, 2013, 02:43:07 PM
I have created a FreeBasic version of FireFly but FreeBasic somewhat closely resembles PowerBasic so the conversion is a little easier. If it were C/C++ or similar then it would be harder.
Paul,
You could achieve c/c++ with support for bc9Basic/BCX. ;D
http://bc9.bcxbasic.com/
I am close to posting an update( this week?)
James
Quote from: James Fuller on September 19, 2013, 07:24:32 AM... c/c++ with bc9Basic/BCX ... http://bc9.bcxbasic.com/ ...
James... I've become intrigued by the idea of BC9... what C++ compiler is the *best* for use with it?
Jim,
Well it depends :)
I have tested a number of them in both 32 and 64 bit.
If you can live without 64 bit and full c++11 compliance this one is probably the best.
http://nuwen.net/mingw.html
Ver 10.4 (32 bit only)
A number of external libraries included (pcre3 is the biggie here for me).
His latest is a 64 bit but I have not tried it.
While a bit behind (there is a message as to why) this was the one I used for quite some time.
It will compile both 32 and 64 bit with just a -m32 or -m64 on the command line.
http://tdm-gcc.tdragon.net/
It is a bit behind on some c++11 items but is still a good choice for both 32 and 64 bit support.
I have switched to this MinGW project (a fork of the official MinGW project ?)
http://sourceforge.net/projects/mingwbuilds/files/host-windows/releases/4.8.1/
It is not supported by the current bc9Basic with batch files but I will be releasing a new bc9Basic shortly.
The bc9Basic package also supports the free Borland c++ and the Visual C++ from the Win7 SDK.
James
QuoteWhat do you guys do to motivate yourself to do programming?
I used to program for hours every day but for almost a year now I have a very hard time igniting that passion that drove me create so many applications that you guys have seen and other ones that I used at my job. With Bob passing and PB in a state of limbo, I think that has just compounded my lack of interest (not sure if "lack of interest" are the right words).
Over the past few years, I have struggled with motivation when it comes to programming. I recently looked back over the past few years an asked myself what programming did I do during this time that I truly enjoyed and brought me pleasure? The answer was pretty easy for me, programming for homebrew systems. I was the only one who used these programs that were written and I enjoyed them a lot. I liked programming just for me. It certainly beats contract work which is often mind-numbingly boring.
What I am doing to motivate myself, is strictly work on some software for myself, that I like and would enjoy using and put it out there and hope others will like it, too. I am concentrating on pleasing myself instead of others with my programming. It will help keep the skills up and hopefully it can generate some income.
Of course coming back to PB after a hiatus of a couple of years, it seems I have forgotten so much. :(
I'd say it's a combination of being worn out a bit and the lack of hope. See to people with strong believes and how they sometimes endure a lifetime of shit in belief of a "reward" â€" a promise of something better to come.
Been there, done that. I've spent a lot of time with and about webOS since 2009 and although I'm not clinging to a false hope of resurrection anymore, some still are. Without the hope, we very often loose our drive â€" unless we're so boring that routine is our climax.
Although I fall out in periods sometimes, I luckily get to code a little at work and I always seem to enjoy it. It's got to have something to do with the challenge and the creative part of starting with an idea and building something people will appreciate. â€" As long as it's not completely overwhelming or an outright boring project.
And look to John's snug comment â€" that's where my motivation to get stuff done went. Next time I'm touching Battlefield, I'll round 800 hours ... 8o/
Quote... but with the failure of Windows 8
Fill me in, cause I seem to be one of the very few that likes w8 as much as I loath w7 and it's instability and other issues. I've even invested in a Surface Pro, and w8 makes perfect sense on it.
You should try to get into a project that is used by customers.
And then your motivatiuon should be to make them say "WOW" at the next update.
That works for me.
Bwsides that,
- "making better algo's",
- finding a "new way to do something"
- not only "exploring technologies that others have developed" like Jose, but
- developing new things myself (like Jose's CWindow Class" and like your "Object Framework".
There is in fact no such large difference WHAT you really work - as long as its good for society (means other people).
Ehatever you do, you will be motivated by making others happy and having them talk about that what you did to make them beeing fine.
Take any Job, if its a bussiness job, you will always try to
- "making better algo's",
- finding a "new way to do something"
- make something "people like and feel love"
Even if you go to politics that would be your natural Job,
to do unless you are corrupt and paid like actual politicians ...
If you have a Job where you can not get this feeling,
be ready to feel unhappy every day, and be ready to live from "weekend to weekend"
which is not the way I want to live.
This new little program has me feeling more motivated: http://www.planetsquires.com/protect/forum/index.php?topic=3411
Paul, I am excited about this debugger!
And very glad that you again have fun in programming!
I am experiencing that same feeling with my own new little project!