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Support Forums => General Board => Topic started by: José Roca on January 17, 2019, 12:27:24 PM

Title: The planetary health diet
Post by: José Roca on January 17, 2019, 12:27:24 PM
Who came up with this?

A group of 37 scientists from around the world were brought together as part of the EAT-Lancet commission.

They're a mix of experts from farming to climate change to nutrition. They took two years to come up with their findings which have been published in the Lancet.

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-46865204

The funny part is that it is very close to the diet that I have followed during all my life (when I was a child, the Mediterranean diet was the only one where I live). They could have saved a lot of work and money if they had asked me first :)
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: José Roca on January 17, 2019, 12:30:36 PM
Who wants a burger when you can have this:

(https://www.planetsquires.com/protect/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.abc.es%2FMedia%2F201012%2F04%2FTOPRECURSO--644x362.jpg&hash=890fe71eaaf93288cbe8ff6b65184d57)
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: Paul Squires on January 17, 2019, 03:20:35 PM
Sadly, it will probably be another generation or two before people wake up to the killer health effects of a normal Western diet. José, you're lucky to have grown up in an area of the world where people view food and diet in a much more progressive light than over here in North America. For the most part, the diet here is HUGE portions of crap food. Food that is cheap for the consumer and heavily subsidized by government. Milk, dairy, pork, beef.... fast food everywhere. When people talk about health food they're viewed mostly as crazy vegans. I practice intermittent fasting and just stopping putting food in my mouth for 16 hours at a time has made me feel better, faster, stronger... and less lazy.
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: Petrus Vorster on January 17, 2019, 03:38:51 PM
I assume neither of you two look like i do.....
Lots of beef down here. Fast food joints from here now all over the planet.
Steers, Nando's, etc, etc. They are everywhere....
Especially in my shirt and pant sizes.
I take my hat off to someone who can fast 16 hours....
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: SeaVipe on January 17, 2019, 04:43:57 PM
Ditto, @Petrus Vorster !
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: José Roca on January 18, 2019, 01:15:17 AM
I never buy processed food. Even a jar of tomato sauce contains a lot of sugar, salt and preservatives. I buy fresh food and cook it myself.

Now is the season for Navel oranges where I live. I buy them to a farmer of my town for half an euro a Kg. I add to them a little of raw orange blossom honey and some nuts. Cheap, healthy and delicious.

(https://m1.paperblog.com/i/170/1709561/naranja-miel-nueces-L-HVnqpJ.jpeg)
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: Joerg Buckel on January 18, 2019, 08:28:39 AM
@Josè
Very tasty.

A big problem of our time is that many young people no longer learn how to cook properly.
I often observe that young people without work resort to ready meals, although they don't have the money for this but they have the time to cook.
Cooking yourself is not more expensive, but warming up finished food is more convenient.

I agree with you 100% that the finished products contain far too much sugar and salt.It is well known that these products are too expensive, make us obese and cause heart and circulatory problems.

And yet there are fewer and fewer people who eat like you.
I am glad that my wife can cook and almost exclusively buys fresh seasonal products.And I am glad that my wife taught all our children how to cook.
Can you blame the young people if their parents haven't learned it yet?
Certainly not an accusation, but it is not an excuse either. Anyone can learn it.

Even I.....
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: Petrus Vorster on January 19, 2019, 03:14:40 AM
Josè, you probably do triathlon too?

Man, you are a super programmer, you live healthy and you are probably rich too?
The only stuff they grow here are Corn, Peanuts, Pecan, Sunflowers and cotton.
O and cattle, loads of cattle everywhere.
Not a single Orange or fruit tree in 300km. To dry and immensely hot.
KFC just a small distance....Steers..just a mile.....etc, etc,
Supermarket veggies and cans of processed foods then...

There is a saying here "Never trust a skinny chef", but it seems you have it worked out pretty well.
And Spain is famous for its oranges...
My previous branch was far from here and at least we had bucketloads of cherries & asparagus, but that was about it.

Nowadays all the farms had been commercialized and they pack and store onsite to ship out.
Nobody here sells directly to the public anymore.

Seems you have it good there.
 
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: José Roca on January 19, 2019, 05:50:48 AM
As a Spanish philosopher said, "I am myself and my circumstance". I was born in the Horta of Valencia, an ideal place to grown vegetables, oranges and rice, but not cattle. Therefore, we did eat a lot of vegetables, fruits, rice, legumes and fish, and little meat (mainly chicken, rabbit, pork and lamb). Rice is our speciality: not only the world famous paella valenciana, but we have more than 300 different recipes. Like rice has no flavor of its own and it absorbs the flavor of the added condiments, it never tires you (as long as you don't eat paella everyday...). If I had been born in a different place, no doubt that my diet would be different. I have been lucky that what we had to eat was tasty and healthy.

Now it is very different. The young generations have become adept to junk food and obesity has become a big problem. It is very sad to see this happening in a country famous by its cuisine. We also used to walk a lot; now we are seeing and increasing number of young boys using kick scooters.

The consequences of junk food are known: obesity, diabetes, cholesterol, etc. You live less and in worse condition. But I not only follow and healthy diet because it is better for my health, but also because I like it more. Instead of a burger and a soft drink, it is much better a portion of Spanish omelette with a glass of wine, or any other of our famous "tapas".

(https://www.lareiragourmet.com/media/images/tortilla-1509881286.png)

Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: raymw on January 19, 2019, 08:02:51 AM
In the same way that facebook, twitter, google etc have teams of folk designed to hook you in and keep you addicted, the fast food companies have teams of people knowing the exact amount of fat and sugars to get you addicted to their products. Unfortunately many folk have an 'addictive gene', and it is very hard work for them to resist. Folk I know have had there stomach stapled, most of their gut removed, but still try and eat the manufactured rubbish. Of course, difficult for some to resist the advertising, red bull being a prime example. It was banned in many countries due to its harmfulness, but money changes hands at high levels, and now it is accepted, more or less world wide. afaik, coca cola don't sell much in Scotland, and I'm not sure if starbucks are in Italy yet.

For folk in an urban environment, ones used to 'sell by dates instead of using their nose, getting good fresh food would be a logistics nightmare. Over here, in UK, very difficult to get anything fresh in the supermarkets - tomatoes are wood chips and water, apples are a year old (kept in a cool gassed environment in large warehouses), lots of 'buy now, rot at home', mixed leaves in a bag filled with a gas to keep 'em fresh, and they wilt within half hour of bag being opened - but it's cheap compared to more artisan suppliers. Their used to be a season for apples and pears, beans, potatoes, etc. Now stuff shipped world wide, parts of the world being deforested to produce the latest fad of beans, coffee, whatever.

But few care. apparently many young families do not have a dining room table in their homes.

I suppose, as I grew up with the remnants of food rationing, in UK, after ww2, My taste is not the same as most younger folk.
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: Theo Gottwald on February 14, 2019, 01:37:41 PM
Read this and understand taht a "Human made CLimate Change" is just a new Pseudo religion.

Man Made Climate Change Religion (https://translate.google.de/translate?sl=de&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.misesde.org%2F%3Fp%3D21339)

(https://media.licdn.com/dms/image/C4D22AQEjiiyEXb2WVw/feedshare-shrink_8192/0?e=1550253600&v=beta&t=EZ13fapBC7GZoKTNgA-GnNtDpFCCuTLp4LsZoM_eGUE)
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: José Roca on February 14, 2019, 02:17:59 PM
This thread was about eating healthy, not about climate change, so please don't act like a troll.
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: Theo Gottwald on February 19, 2019, 07:34:20 AM
If you want do something to additionally improve your halth, Jose look for alkaline water.
I have much better knowledge in healthy diet then in programming :-) so you can ask me if you want to progress on that.
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: raymw on February 19, 2019, 12:26:21 PM
Hi Theo,
Perhaps you can explain the coloured chart you've posted. What do the numbers signify? Why is it that fruit juices have the group number 6, whereas lemons have the group number 10. I've always thought that most fruits are acidic e.g. lemons, limes, apples.
Ray
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: Andrew Lindsay on February 21, 2019, 09:19:01 AM
A little bit of science.


https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/tag/alkaline-water/ (https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/tag/alkaline-water/)
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: raymw on February 21, 2019, 11:21:16 AM
Who wants a burger when you can have this:

(https://www.planetsquires.com/protect/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.abc.es%2FMedia%2F201012%2F04%2FTOPRECURSO--644x362.jpg&hash=890fe71eaaf93288cbe8ff6b65184d57)

Hi Jose,
Is that Serrano ham? If so I have some, it often comes in small packs with a selection of Cherizo, in Lidl's supermarket/elsewhere. I quite like it, but differently processed compared to the UK type of ham. It is almost like bacon in texture. I guess it's from a different part of the pig. It's quite expensive over here, will most likely be unobtainable in a month or so...

Best wishes,

Ray
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: José Roca on February 21, 2019, 12:06:18 PM
No, it is Iberian ham, but it is very expensive, even in Spain. I buy ham of Teruel, that is much better than Serrano and not too expensive here.

> I guess it's from a different part of the pig.

An Spanish ham is a dry-cured leg of a pork.

(https://delicatessenmed.com/463-826-large/jamon-de-teruel-denominacion-origen-serrano-entero-con-hueso-9-kgs-aprox-.jpg)
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: José Roca on February 21, 2019, 12:17:51 PM
A little bit of science.


https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/tag/alkaline-water/ (https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/tag/alkaline-water/)

Magical drinks and "superfoods" are marketing scams to suck your money.

What makes a big difference is if you are willing to buy fresh products and cook them yourself or if you prefer to buy processed food and heat it in the microwave.

Where I live we have the best oranges in the world and are cheap, yet many people prefer to buy bottled orange juice.
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: raymw on February 21, 2019, 08:54:28 PM
Talking of oranges, a few years back, sales fell off in supermarkets, since folk couldn't be bothered to peel oranges. Lots of 'easy peel' oranges now. In many countries they don't peel them, but bite/cut a hole in the end, and suck out the juice.
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: José Roca on February 22, 2019, 11:04:01 AM
> Lots of 'easy peel' oranges now

They are of worse quality.

> In many countries they don't peel them, but bite/cut a hole in the end, and suck out the juice.

And they lose all the fiber.

Cooking needs patience and practice, but the results are rewarding.
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: Petrus Vorster on February 22, 2019, 02:10:57 PM
Ahh, at least we produce some good quality over here, except in the exact opposite time of the year.
Now is Mango time over here. Cheap and delicious.
Pineapples plenty now.
Oranges here only in July. Some good export stuff at least available here.
Some guys about 300km from here exports all the way to Russia. From the tip of Africa to Russia....and still profit.
No ham like yours. We can get the italian stuff which sells for ridiculous prices at deli's but then we have South African Biltong.
(But most definitely not so very healthy! BEEF,BEEF,BEEF)
(Biltong is the bigger, fatter, naturally cured thick cut and better tasting big cousin of Jerky)

And South Africans eat that stuff by the bucketload....hence we look like most Americans....
The only Spanish product you will ever see in a supermarket is Olive Oil and smoked Paprika, but that is that.
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: Andrew Lindsay on February 23, 2019, 07:02:13 AM

Magical drinks and "superfoods" are marketing scams to suck your money.

What makes a big difference is if you are willing to buy fresh products and cook them yourself or if you prefer to buy processed food and heat it in the microwave.

Where I live we have the best oranges in the world and are cheap, yet many people prefer to buy bottled orange juice.


I agree, whole-heartedly.  I love cooking fresh, there's nothing better than freshly caught and cooked marron, straight from the dam, even if they do react badly with me the next day.
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: raymw on February 23, 2019, 06:12:53 PM
A bit of a chat about the USA diet, etc. I don't know exactly what their 'food pyramid' is, but most likely could guess well enough, if I was that interest, and could find out easy enough. We were fitter after ww2, not so much food, and little of it processed. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zvdlpFWk0Zg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zvdlpFWk0Zg)
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: José Roca on February 25, 2019, 10:02:02 AM
Yesterday, Bloomberg published its list of World's Healthiest Nations.

"Maybe it’s something in the gazpacho or paella, as Spain just surpassed Italy to become the world’s healthiest country."

See: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-02-24/spain-tops-italy-as-world-s-healthiest-nation-while-u-s-slips

Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: Paul Squires on February 25, 2019, 01:38:38 PM
Jose, I saw that story in my news feed this morning and immediately thought of you and this thread.  :)
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: José Roca on February 25, 2019, 02:09:09 PM
The relation with this thread:

Quote
Eating Habits

Researchers say eating habits may provide clues to health levels enjoyed by Spain and Italy, as a “Mediterranean diet, supplemented with extra-virgin olive oil or nuts, had a lower rate of major cardiovascular events than those assigned to a reduced-fat diet,” according to a study led by the University of Navarra Medical School.

If we eat better, we live more.

Do you know that I never have eaten an hamburguer? Only its appearance already disgusts me.
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: raymw on February 25, 2019, 02:27:48 PM
I couldn't immediately find where the UK was in the table, but 19, iirc, better than I thought. I found this http://www.healthfitnessrevolution.com/10-healthiest-countries-in-the-world/ (http://www.healthfitnessrevolution.com/10-healthiest-countries-in-the-world/), and although not up-to-date, it gives other aspects to the results. My grandfather lived quite a while, he used to sleep most afternoons - he was a fisherman, and his work depended on the  tides, to a certain extent. wrt burgers often consisting of 'engineered meat' you probably don't want to know what that is.

Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: José Roca on February 25, 2019, 05:33:09 PM
Supersize me!

(https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-748052f0bc0c3abb3b2307ad609e3b7b-c)
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: Joerg Buckel on February 26, 2019, 02:05:01 AM
Hi
These parents don't even know what they're doing to their kids.
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: Petrus Vorster on February 27, 2019, 12:56:33 PM
I travel a lot.
Just last week i was in a large town in North West.
Lunch time. SO what is around me in about 3KM radius?
Mcdonalds, Pizza Hut, Steers, Debonairs Pizza, Nando's, WIMPY (much like Wendy's).
So for the man on the road, what do you do? Drive-through of course!
And Mcdonalds is closest.
And the company gave me a new Ford Ranger Pickup and after a struggle with the safety-belt to get in, i realised i am so in trouble.
But the problem is also, in that radius, there is not a single place that really sells something decent at a good price.
Then again, even where i stay. Only the local SPAR(i don't know if you have this supermarket group) you can buy reasonable Sunday dinners, but during the week they too sells Pies, rolls, fries, and all fatty deep fried stuff.
This is the problem everywhere. Everyone is in a rush and the fast food industry, even those with good intentions, all sells burgers, fries, and my personal favourite and reason for my big butt : Coca-Cola.

A dire situation indeed.
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: José Roca on February 27, 2019, 03:37:58 PM
Tapas: The Spanish fast food

(https://www.diadios.com/assets/images/Tematiche/Comidas/tapas2.27c80901.jpg)

(https://www.shbarcelona.es/blog/es/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/tapas-to-tantalise-your-tastebuds-in-barcelona-810x456.jpg)
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: José Roca on February 27, 2019, 03:43:01 PM
I was a little hungry after posting here, so I have eaten some esgarraet, which is a typical tapa of Valencia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esgarrat

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/39/Esgrarrat_%28Meliana%29.jpg/500px-Esgrarrat_%28Meliana%29.jpg)
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: Joerg Buckel on February 28, 2019, 03:54:23 AM
Good Morning to all.

We have a lot of supermarkets with us.Spar, Edeka, Rewe, Aldi, Lidl, Norma. These are the bigger supermarkets in our country.
If our Spar are identical with your Spar, I can't say.
In these supermarkets you can buy all your groceries. From fresh ingredients to fast food products. But the prices in the supermarkets are very different.
Spar, Edeka and Rewe are aimed at people who have more money and can afford better quality.
Lidl, Norma are aimed at people who have to make do with less money.
So the quality suffers a little.
Aldi lies between the two categories.
But as already said, "little money" and a healthy diet are not mutually exclusive.
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: Petrus Vorster on February 28, 2019, 12:19:40 PM
I think this is more of a culture thing.
The Europeans have their Mediterranean Diet. Josè's Tapas, the French with their Wine and salads, the Germans with the beer! but also a reasonably healthy diet. the Japanese & Koreans, lots of fish, little beef, much veggies.
But these countries that was built by many immigrants seem to have the problem.
America is a whole bunch of immigrants. South Africa was made of the Dutch, French and Local indigenous tribes with a good shot of Indian and malaysian influences.
In the cities you get good supermarkets. In Cape Town and Stellenbosch where the stinking rich stays ($50 Million US kind of people) there are fabulous wine routes, salami makers, italian and French restaurants and a couple of Michelin star places.
But here in the mining areas, its is "shut up and buy the crap" kind of approach...because 50% of the people cant drive 200km to buy groceries.
Second image below is what a Large restaurant group in Cape town sells as SPANISH TAPAS....
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: José Roca on February 28, 2019, 03:30:31 PM
If you live in a so called food desert, there isn't much that you can do. My main criticism goes toward people that having access to fresh products buy processed food to not have to cook.

> Second image below is what a Large restaurant group in Cape town sells as SPANISH TAPAS....

What a rubbish! Compare them with the true ones above...

Also compare a true paella valenciana

(https://cdn1.cocina-familiar.com/recetas/thumb/paella-valenciana-la-autentica.JPG)

with Jamie Oliver's chicken and chorizo paella

(https://ocio.lne.es/img_contenido/noticias/2016/10/533747/jamie_oliver_paella.jpg)

Everything in his recipe and in the technique used to cook it is wrong, and does not look appetizing. It is what we call rice with stuff in it.

These chefs are going to discredit the Spanish cuisine.

How celebrity chefs destroy classic Spanish dishes

https://elpais.com/elpais/2016/03/15/inenglish/1458045165_873693.html

Worth reading.
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: Joerg Buckel on March 02, 2019, 02:22:39 PM
Hello to All

According to a recent statistical survey I heard today, only about 26 percent of households in Germany still cook. The trend is downward.
Poor Germany.
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: raymw on March 03, 2019, 09:16:47 AM
When I was a lad, growing in a small almost coastal town, the only takeaways we had was a fish and chip shop. Fished locally, spuds grown locally, deep fried in lard. You had to walk to the fish and chip shop. Now (not in the same town) the global chains are there, and the independent takeaways - Chinese, Kebabs, Indians, Thai, etc. They all deliver. The other aspect is what you are actually eating. Beef injected with growth hormones and antibiotics, chickens - a chemical conversion from a day old chick to 42 days, 3.5 lb bird, the fancy demands for green beans decimating countrysides in Africa, never mind palm oil, etc. You think fish is OK, - never get Scottish salmon, farmed crap and that cheap catfish thing from Vietnam  - lethal if refrozen.
Even if you try and 'grow your own' it is more than a full time job.
The idea is to process food, you can make burghers from all of the cow. Chicken Kievs, -all the chicken - no food regulations to cover how much chicken. Fish cakes/fingers whatever is in those. Load it with fat and sugar and 'flavour enhancers' to camouflage the blahness and make folk happy, and get into bed with the pharmaceutical companies and sell diet plans, diabetic cures, etc. The whole thing is crazy, but not to the purveyors.
People are uneducated thes4e days wrt food. Need sell by dates. Don't know about raw and cooked food cross contamination. All the labour/time saving devices, and what do they do with the time they save?
Bit of a rant, but I expect I'll get over it XD

Best wishes,

Ray (who still hasn't got my head round the usb mouse thingy...
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: José Roca on March 03, 2019, 01:00:54 PM
They are already planning to build houses without a kitchen.

One factor driving the gradual extinction of the kitchen is the explosion of food delivery apps. According to UBS, food delivery apps are now, on average, in the top 40 most downloaded apps in major markets. They’re particularly beloved by millennials, who are three times more likely to order takeaway than their parents. “As this generation matures, home cooking could fade away,” the report suggests.

See: https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/food-and-drink/would-you-live-in-a-house-without-a-kitchen-you-might-be-very-soon-1.3553616
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: SeaVipe on March 03, 2019, 03:54:44 PM

I watch this thread and read it most days and can't help but notice how, for the most part, everyone is saying roughly the same thing: most of us simply don't eat properly.
I live in Kamloops, a city of barely one-hundred-thousand located in the "Interior" of British Columbia which is on the West coast about three-hundred kilometres North East of Vancouver, Canada.
Canada, perhaps the most sparsely populated country in the World. About thirty-five-million people spread over the second largest country on planet Earth. The area where I live is in Canada's only real desert (semi-arid) where there are rattlesnakes and tumbleweed well within the city limits. And this is cattle country where cattle roam gigantic ranges that have never seen fertilizer. Beef is cheap and lean cuts are cheaper.
The growing season here is (more or less) from April to October (sorry Paul!) and just about everything grows here, although citrus fruits need a greenhouse. I grow apples, peaches, cherries, apricots and two varieties of plums. Our garden always has raspberries, blueberries, strawberries and tomatoes plus whatever else we feel like planting in the spring – potatoes, cucumbers, carrots, cellary, whatever. Our three (3) freezers and the cellar are always full of cans and jars from the seasons harvest so much so that we have plenty for the local food bank.
I was born in Uckfield, England just after the War and until moving to Canada in nineteen-fifty-six I ate fried bread, sausages and any other food my parents were able to get their hands on. My grandfather was a fishmonger so there was often fish on the dinner table and kippers (fish) for breakfast.
Once in Canada, I traded my English schoolboy shorts for jeans, my school uniform beany for a cowboy hat and fried bread and kippers for burgers, hot dogs and French fries – Heaven!
So now I’m older and wiser (?) and surrounded by so much inexpensive and nutritious food, why do I have lunch at least once a week at MacDonald’s or Burger King and breakfast once a week at Tim Hortons or Starbucks!? Simple: cheap, fast and oh’ so tasty.


On your very interesting point, José:
I'm a Realtor® (Estate Agent) and see lots of residential kitchens and in my little city the kitchens in new housing (see image) are getting so big that they rival in size small apartments so popular with millennials in down in rainy Vancouver. Maybe it's an age thing, the older you get the more you cook. My wife and I cook a lot and we always do our best to cook low salt, low fat, healthy. Eat your heart out, Jamie Oliver!
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: José Roca on March 09, 2019, 03:47:10 PM
How America’s food giants swallowed the family farms

"Across the midwest, the rise of factory farming is destroying rural communities. And the massive corporations behind this devastation are now eyeing a post-Brexit UK market."

Very interesting article. See: https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/mar/09/american-food-giants-swallow-the-family-farms-iowa
Title: Re: The planetary health diet
Post by: José Roca on March 16, 2019, 11:53:46 AM
Another nail in the coffin. French tacos, "a hymn to junk food".

See: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/mar/15/move-over-mcdonalds-french-taco-poised-for-global-expansion